Taking on Ark Times Bloggers on various issues Part F “Carl Sagan’s views on how God should try and contact us” includes film “The Basis for Human Dignity”

I have gone back and forth and back and forth with many liberals on the Arkansas Times Blog on many issues such as abortion, human rights, welfare, poverty, gun control  and issues dealing with popular culture. Here is another exchange I had with them a while back. My username at the Ark Times Blog is Saline Republican.

On 2-21-13 on the Arkansas Times Blog  the person using the username “Olphart” asserted: 

” then there is no final appeal to judge between individuals and groups whose moral judgements conflict.”

Then why don’t you appeal “Roe vs Wade” to God? Obviously, that is WHOM you mean. Sounds OK to me, appeal all decisions by SCOTUS to God. While you’re at it, appeal all the officials’ decisions in the NFL, and the NCAA to God as well. Tim Tebow would certainly benefit from this if they ever actually let him play again. And don’t even suggest that this is silly because if God notes the falling of every sparrow then this won’t be any problem for the AllMighty. One thing, the decisions must come in writing, direct from Heaven and not from some self-appointed earthly representative such as yourself.

On 2-21-13 on the Arkansas Times Blog  I responded: 

Olphart you suggest that the Almighty hand down written decisions to us if he wants us to follow him. That reminds me of what Carl Sagan suggested.

I have read lots of Carl Sagan’s books and written several reviews and papers on his views. I will just leave you with this thought.

Sagan observed,”Plainly, there’s something within me that’s ready to believe in life after death…If some good evidence for life after death was announced, I’d be eager to examine it; but it would have to be real scientific data, not mere antedote”(pp 203-204, The DemonHaunted World, 1995). 

Sagan said he had taken a look at Old Testament prophecy and it did not impress him because it was too vague. He had taken a look at Christ’s life in the gospels, but said it was unrealistic for God to send a man to communicate for God. Instead, Sagan suggested that God could have written a mathematical formula in the Bible or put a cross in the sky.However, what happens at the conclusion of the movie Contact?  This is Sagan’s last message to the world in the form of the movie that appeared shortly after his death. Dr Arroway (Jodie Foster) who is a young atheistic scientist who meets with an alien and this alien takes the form of Dr. Arroway’s father. The alien tells her that they thought this would make it easier for her. In fact, he meets her on a beach that resembles a beach that she grew up near so she would also be comfortable with the surroundings. Carl Sagan when writing this script chose to put the alien in human form so Dr. Arroway could relate to the alien. Christ chose to take our form and come into our world too and still many make up excuses for not believing.

Olphart you have a head knowledge of the Bible and you say you would accept written decisions from God but you would not. Just like Sagan you set out stipulations for God but He has given you sufficient evidence through Old Testiment prophecies such as the one on the destruction of Tyre and also Psalms 22 and Isaiah 53.You do not accept them because of intellectual problems but you want your independence. Very smart people are believers and some dummies too. It has nothing to do with how smart a person is.

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In the film series “WHATEVER HAPPENED TO THE HUMAN RACE?” the arguments are presented  against abortion (Episode 1),  infanticide (Episode 2),   euthenasia (Episode 3), and then there is a discussion of the Christian versus Humanist worldview concerning the issue of “the basis for human dignity” in Episode 4 and then in the last episode a close look at the truth claims of the Bible

I truly believe that many of the problems we have today in the USA are due to the advancement of humanism in the last few decades in our society. The  Ronald Reagan appointed the evangelical Dr. C. Everett Koop to the position of Surgeon General in his administration. He partnered with Dr. Francis Schaeffer in making the video below. It is very valuable information for Christians to have.  Actually I have included a video below that includes comments from him on this subject.

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Francis Schaeffer and his wife Edith pictured above.

Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 4) THE BASIS FOR HUMAN DIGNITY

Published on Oct 7, 2012 by

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A great article on the sad case of Roe v Wade:

Blood Guilt…Roe v Wade
http://billrandles.wordpress.com/2011/01/23/blood-guilt-roe-v-wade/ ^ | 1-23-11 | Bill Randles

Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2011 9:32:47 AM by pastorbillrandles

And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother’s blood crieth unto me from the ground. (Genesis 4:10)

America has recently passed a gruesome milestone, we have had the fifty millionth abortion. It is staggering isn’t it? Fifty million boys and girls since 1973. They would range in age from 1 to 38 years old, had they been allowed to live.

Fifty million people! By now they would have been husbands and wives, mothers and fathers, skilled and unskilled laborers , professionals, scientists, ministers, leaders, who knows what we have forfeited ?

Fifty million human lives snuffed out, for what? Convenience? Liberation? Liberation from what? Liberation from Love? From the beauty of womanhood? Liberated from marriage? In truth we have liberated ourselves from decency, commitment, and innocence.

Let us not forget that every abortion not only kills the precious baby in the womb, but also the mother who either willingly or is subjected or pressured into the barbaric procedure. She too is unalterably deadened to true femininity, tenderness and the natural affection God puts into all female hearts.

Thus we have the specter of the tough, steely, masculine woman, out to prove she can do it better than any man, she is liberated from the feminine, she “can have it all”! Abortion was to be the sacrament that would liberate women everywhere, “You’ve come a long way baby!”.What a cruel, cruel hoax.

The greatest suffering would be borne by women (After the baby of course). How many spiritually and emotionally scarred women there are, bearing the guilt and shame, all because they believed in the feminist propaganda. In allowing the murder of their own child, they have killed something in themselves.

How many young girls have been put under pressure by immoral “boyfriends”, or by cruel parents and even husbands to abort the life God has vouchsafed in their own womb? Shattered and ruined, many of these are on tranquilizers, many more are in some form of fruitless counseling, others have hardened themselves , seeking solace in the ever increasingly shrill and overly defensive feminist movement.

The plague of homosexuality comes out of the ethic that gave us abortion. Abortion was supposed to equalize the genders, women were going to throw off the shackles of pregnancy, and be just as free as any man to be promiscuous. Women have become more like men, because our perverted generation despises the God assigned role of a woman as supporter, nurturer and life bearer.

They have broken the link between sex and fruitful marriage, but the unforseen consequences have proven that they have also broken the link between sex and love. The abortion culture has cheapened sex, marriage, women, human life,commitment,tenderness, and everything that makes human life noble and honorable.

By now we have begun to reap the consequences of the sexual liberation movement, and its ugly, misshapen offspring, abortion on demand. The explosion of sexually transmitted diseases, the millions of shattered families, the debasement of motherhood, and of womanhood in general, were all made much more likely by the tragedy of Jan 22, 1973.

On top of that the loss of 53 million Americans. Who knows how rich, how secure, how robust our nation would be if we had an ethic of life and not death? We certainly wouldn’t have a Social Security problem, nor would we have an illegal immigrant problem. Death is never the answer, Life is. We need more of the Image of God not less.

God is an avenger, especially of the fatherless and most helpless. That is why I believe we are already experiencing God’s righteous judgment. Blood spilt on the ground cries out to Him, and we should not imagine He doesn’t regard. A sparrow cannot fall out of a tree somewhere without God’s attention, a baby is worth much, much more than a sparrow.

On this anniversary of Roe v Wade, 53 million innocent lives and 38 years later, I tremble when I remember that A Holy God knows still, what a millstone is, and which people and nations deserve to wear one and be thrown into the sea.

We have in Kermit Gosnell a perfect and fitting poster child for the monsters the culture of death has made us into. This Philadelphia “health provider”,(Don’t you just love the Orwellian Newspeak), running a squalid abortion mill in Philadelphia, actually delivered eight full term babies and killed them with scissors. He would often use those scissors to break the infant spines in their mother’s wombs. He was only brought up on murder charges when a young patient of his died in a botched abortion.

Behold the human face of Roe v Wade! Full sanctioned and licensed by the Government, running a clinic so squalid they found a collection of thirty aborted bodies in it, yet it passed all health inspections until the “botched” abortion killed a young woman.

This bloody and deceitful monster is a sign to us that God’s judgment is coming on this evil generation. We have sold out our christian heritage for a mess of pottage, and the monsters are beginning to emerge. God just thrust a mirror into the face of pro-choice America, the Image is doctor Gosnell.

Francis Schaeffer warned us that rejecting the Christian absolute that was the bedrock of our culture would have unthinkable consequences,

If man is not made in the image of God, nothing then stands in the way of inhumanity. There is no good reason why mankind should be perceived as special. Human life is cheapened. We can see this in many of the major issues being debated in our society today: abortion, infanticide, euthanasia, the increase of child abuse and violence of all kinds, pornography (and its particular kinds of violence as evidenced in sadomasochism), the routine torture of political prisoners in many parts of the world, the crime explosion, and the random violence which surrounds us. (Francis A. Schaeffer and C. Everette Koop, Whatever Happened to the Human Race?, Ch. 1)

We need to mourn our nation and preach the gospel while there is time.


Related posts:

Francis Schaeffer’s prayer for us in USA

 Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 1) ABORTION OF THE HUMAN RACE Published on Oct 6, 2012 by AdamMetropolis The 45 minute video above is from the film series created from Francis Schaeffer’s book “Whatever Happened to the Human Race?” with Dr. C. Everett Koop. This book  really helped develop my political views […]

 

Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 10 “Final Choices” (Schaeffer Sundays)

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Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 7 “The Age of Non-Reason” (Schaeffer Sundays)

E P I S O D E 7 Dr. Francis Schaeffer – Episode VII – The Age of Non Reason I am thrilled to get this film series with you. I saw it first in 1979 and it had such a big impact on me. Today’s episode is where we see modern humanist man act […]

Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 6 “The Scientific Age” (Schaeffer Sundays)

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Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 5 “The Revolutionary Age” (Schaeffer Sundays)

E P I S O D E 5 How Should We Then Live? Episode 5: The Revolutionary Age I was impacted by this film series by Francis Schaeffer back in the 1970′s and I wanted to share it with you. Francis Schaeffer noted, “Reformation Did Not Bring Perfection. But gradually on basis of biblical teaching there […]

Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 4 “The Reformation” (Schaeffer Sundays)

Dr. Francis Schaeffer – Episode IV – The Reformation 27 min I was impacted by this film series by Francis Schaeffer back in the 1970′s and I wanted to share it with you. Schaeffer makes three key points concerning the Reformation: “1. Erasmian Christian humanism rejected by Farel. 2. Bible gives needed answers not only as to […]

“Schaeffer Sundays” Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 3 “The Renaissance”

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Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 2 “The Middle Ages” (Schaeffer Sundays)

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Francis Schaeffer’s “How should we then live?” Video and outline of episode 1 “The Roman Age” (Schaeffer Sundays)

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Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 5) TRUTH AND HISTORY

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Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 4) THE BASIS FOR HUMAN DIGNITY

The opening song at the beginning of this episode is very insightful. Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 4) THE BASIS FOR HUMAN DIGNITY Published on Oct 7, 2012 by AdamMetropolis This crucial series is narrated by the late Dr. Francis Schaeffer and former Surgeon General Dr. C. Everett Koop. Today, choices […]

Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 3) DEATH BY SOMEONE’S CHOICE

Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 3) DEATH BY SOMEONE’S CHOICE Published on Oct 6, 2012 by AdamMetropolis This crucial series is narrated by the late Dr. Francis Schaeffer and former Surgeon General Dr. C. Everett Koop. Today, choices are being made that undermine human rights at their most basic level. Practices […]

Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race?” (Episode 2) SLAUGHTER OF THE INNOCENTS

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Francis Schaeffer: “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” (Episode 1) ABORTION OF THE HUMAN RACE

It is not possible to know where the pro-life evangelicals are coming from unless you look at the work of the person who inspired them the most. That person was Francis Schaeffer.  I do care about economic issues but the pro-life issue is the most important to me. Several years ago Adrian Rogers (past president of […]

The following essay explores the role that Francis Schaeffer played in the rise of the pro-life movement. It examines the place of How Should We Then Live?, Whatever Happened to the Human Race?, and A Christian Manifesto in that process.

This essay below is worth the read. Schaeffer, Francis – “Francis Schaeffer and the Pro-Life Movement” [How Should We Then Live?, Whatever Happened to the Human Race?, A Christian Manifesto] Editor note: <p> </p> [The following essay explores the role that Francis Schaeffer played in the rise of the pro-life movement.  It examines the place of […]

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